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"Fire Marshal" training

Discuss all things fire related.

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stephen1974
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"Fire Marshal" training

Post by stephen1974 » Tue Nov 05, 2019 4:13 am

Scenario.
1 Room room, lets say 30m by 20m, two toilets and a kitchen with no closed door off of it. 6 Employees.

Why do they need "Fire Marshal" training?

Yes, they need training on what to do in a fire which is, walk out the front door, is everyone here? Billy, Joe, Jim, Bob, Jack, Jill - yes? right, Dial 999, hello, is that Barney Mcgrew? gotta job for ya.

Am I missing anything? Why do I need to tell these people they need to spend money on an official fire marshal course?

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WillPool
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Re: "Fire Marshal" training

Post by WillPool » Tue Nov 05, 2019 4:58 am

Where does it say you need to have completed a marshall course?

Surely your FRA will tell you your requirements? .scratch

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Re: "Fire Marshal" training

Post by Messy » Tue Nov 05, 2019 7:11 pm

WillPool is spot on. The law states that the employer must provide staff training and training must be commensurate with the risk presented (and identified by the FRA), given on induction and repeated periodically.

So an oil refinery will need lots of training, a 12 storey hotel will require competent training including fire warden training and a small low risk property (like yours) may be able train their staff during a team meeting. Instruct can = training these circumstances.

Areas to cover may include

The allocation of responsibilities (who is calling 999)
Where to meet up
Your fire extinguisher policy (Training will be required if you instruct your staff to use them)

Then record the training session, the subjects covered and who was there. Get staff to sign they have received instruction and diarise for it to be repeated in due course (maybe 12m?)

stephen1974
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Re: "Fire Marshal" training

Post by stephen1974 » Tue Nov 05, 2019 10:55 pm

Lets just move away from this almighty belief that your FRA will tell you everything. No it wont. If it did, we wouldnt see assessors being prosecuted now would we. IF an FRA said, in the scenario above, that I needed fire marshals I would question that recommendation.

By fire marshal I mean someone whose gone through a big long course on how to sweep buldings, check doors for heat, blah blah blah.... imo, that isn't always required.

so i agree with what you are saying, appropriate training.


Sorry, my op was just my little rant. Its a case of dealing with people who have a different opinion but because they have done it that way for so long you have the issue of trying to change their minds without implying they've been wrong all along. I'm too blunt to do that.

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Re: "Fire Marshal" training

Post by WillPool » Wed Nov 06, 2019 4:53 am

stephen1974 wrote:
Tue Nov 05, 2019 10:55 pm
Lets just move away from this almighty belief that your FRA will tell you everything. No it wont. If it did, we wouldnt see assessors being prosecuted now would we. IF an FRA said, in the scenario above, that I needed fire marshals I would question that recommendation.
I suggest the reason they are being prosecuted is because they offered poor advise or were not competent. Even though I understand fire risk and have the Fire NEBOSH Cert, I would never conduct a FRA unless it was for a simple task/room etc, I do not deem myself to be competent.

There are too many cowboys out there that will fill out a template (doesnt mean they have assessed anything). Now thats my rant over :twisted: :)

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It is better to be careful 100 times than to get killed once.
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witsd
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Re: "Fire Marshal" training

Post by witsd » Wed Nov 06, 2019 9:22 am

I think the problem is that (especially in the current climate) assessors tend toward over-prescriptive actions.

Try suggesting that actually you don't need any fire doors at all, because the current doors will last at least 10 minutes and everyone will be out in 3, and watch them start to foam at the mouth.

A decent FRA should consider the risk to life, and propose reasonable measures when required – it shouldn't (necessarily) be demanding adherence to every last British Standard if the risk level doesn't necessitate it.

If you aren't getting that, challenge it, and consider getting someone else to carry it out.

(And I'm still under the impression that you have to severely screw up as an assessor in order to be prosecuted)
We often think that when we have completed our study of one we know all about two, because 'two' is 'one and one.' We forget that we still have to make a study of 'and.'

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