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3 Hinges on Fire Doors.

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stephen1974
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3 Hinges on Fire Doors.

Post by stephen1974 » Sat Jul 06, 2019 5:42 am

Where in the regs or standards does it talk about fire doors needing 3 hinges?
I've seen it mentioned a lot in non official guides (ie information that companies in the fire industry put together) but the issue came up when we came across some fire doors the other day that only had two hinges fitted with the client saying no ones ever queried it before, but in this instance someone had. I thought id look it up, but for the life of me I cant find it.

I did find one source that said tests have shown that it is ok to have two hinges on some FD30's though it doesnt eleborate on that in anyway, so unsure if its a specific type of FD30 or it would be ok for all.

Looked in Document B where there is only 2 references to hinges. The first being about butt hinges and the second being hinges being able to withstand 800'c of heat, but nothing about the number of hinges.

BS 8214 doesnt cover it.
BS 9999 doesnt cover it.
BS EN 1935 doesnt cover it.

It must be written down somewhere for so many companies to be putting it out in their guides, but i'd also like to see where this other company saying about two hinges is gettng their information.

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Re: 3 Hinges on Fire Doors.

Post by stephen1974 » Sat Jul 06, 2019 6:00 am

OK. Code of Practice time: Hardware for Fire and Escape Doors.
This says It is usual for at least 3 hinges to be fitted on fire and escape routedoors
It also says In all cases reference should be made to the fire test evidence, andthe tested condition should be followed. The necessary informationshould be on the fire door’s data sheet

I'm guessing thats where the two hinges thing on 'some doors' comes in to play, they've been tested and approved in that way.


This is one of the things I like about this job, having to investigate and resolve issues. The best technique for which seems to be , post a question on a forum, because sods law the very next thing you look at will have the answer in it - though I still can't find any BS standards refernces.

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Re: 3 Hinges on Fire Doors.

Post by Andyblue » Sat Jul 06, 2019 8:16 am

You may find the frequency of seeing 3+ hinges stems from the installers / door spec with 3 or more hinges being fitted based on the door size, weight etc. Look at domestic doors - lightweight or panel doors tend to be 2 with solid or large format being 3 or more even if not fire rated. It’s what the fitters do.

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Re: 3 Hinges on Fire Doors.

Post by bernicarey » Sat Jul 06, 2019 10:54 am

Go back and look at BS EN 1935 again...., but in the meantime....


http://www.firedoorsafetyweek.co.uk/5-step-check/

Fire Door Safety Week
5 Point Checklist


Check for certification Is there a label or plug on top (or occasionally on the side) of the door to show it is a certificated fire door? You can use the selfie function on your camera phone or a mirror to check. If there is, that’s good news, otherwise report it to whoever is in charge of your building.

Check the gaps Check the gaps around the top and sides of the door are consistently less than 4mm when closed. You can use a £1 coin to give a feel for scale, this is about 3mm thick. The gap under the door can be slightly larger (up to 8mm is not uncommon), but it does depend on the door - as a rule of thumb, if you can see light under the door, the gap is likely to be too big. It’s good news if the door fits the frame and it’s not damaged. If not, report it. If the gaps are too big smoke and fire could travel through the cracks.

Check the seals Are there any intumescent seals around the door or frame, and are they intact with no sign of damage? These seals are usually vital to the fire door's performance, expanding if in contact with heat to ensure fire (and in some cases smoke) can’t move through the cracks. If not, report it - the door may not be properly maintained and in the intensity of a fire may not protect you long enough.

Check the hinges Are the hinges firmly fixed (three or more of them), with no missing or broken screws? If you see problems, report it - the door is obviously not properly maintained and in the intensity of a fire may not perform and hold back the fire for long enough.

Check the door closes properly Open the door about halfway, let go and allow it to close by itself. Does it close firmly onto the latch without sticking on the floor or the frame? If not, report it. A fire door only works when it’s closed. A fire door is completely useless if it’s wedged open or can’t close fully.


Fire Doors are usually fitted with a closing mechanism, because a Fire Door without one could easily be left open.

BS EN 1935:2002 Annex E
Annex E.JPG
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Re: 3 Hinges on Fire Doors.

Post by stephen1974 » Sat Jul 06, 2019 8:26 pm

Now thats just weird as I used the search function for the word hinges. Thanks for putting it up.

Thats what I was looking for. The checklist was no good as its just a company throwing out their advice as opposed to actual standards and didnt cover the issue of two hinges at all.


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Re: 3 Hinges on Fire Doors.

Post by joaorosa80 » Sun Jul 07, 2019 11:44 pm

Hi @stephen1974,
what you will you suggest to the client?
The doors replacement? Legal grounds?

When was the building built? Did the local authority approve the project?

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Re: 3 Hinges on Fire Doors.

Post by stephen1974 » Wed Jul 10, 2019 12:03 am

I won't be recommending anything in this case as I was tagging along on someone elses audit.
I will have a chat with them and its their decision what they will do but I don't think anything needs to be done. They are in a low risk workplace with a handful of employees and the building gets cleared in minutes. The doors are not protecting escape routes and both are in the same corridor about 3 metres apart. One of those cases where those doing the work use a 'fire door' for every door regardless of whether it needs to be one.

This was more of an issue regarding the two vs three hinges thing for me so that I would know for future reference.

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Re: 3 Hinges on Fire Doors.

Post by bernicarey » Wed Jul 10, 2019 9:23 am

If they do not actually need to be 'Fire Doors' but the installer has used such anyway, it's more a factor that the door may be too heavy for 2 hinges and will keep drooping.... ;)
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