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Driving for work private and hire cars

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Mel GT
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Driving for work private and hire cars

Post by Mel GT »

Afternoon all......some advice/clarity please if you would be so kind !

I am currently looking at the staff that drive as part of their role and whilst most use hire cars there is an element that use their own car. Currently our policy says this

By requesting to use your private motor vehicle, you are making a legal declaration that you hold a valid licence and the vehicle has an MOT if required and appropriate insurance covering the business journey.

I am tempted to say this is not enough if we are not having sight of the relevant docs or proof that the person is legal to drive - nor does this show any patterns with dangerous driving through fines etc.

Similarly we don't licence check any drivers hiring cars we 'trust' that they are legal to drive

I am proposing we use a service such as IAM or Davis

Thoughts - I am a bit wooly on elements of this I am afraid
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Re: Driving for work private and hire cars

Post by bernicarey »

All people driving on company business, whether company vehicles or their own, should be license checked because if you allow them to operate vehicles when disqualified etc then you are failing to take reasonable measures to protect employees and 'others'. Usually once a year will suffice.

Here's a good starting point: http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/indg382.pdf

There's plenty of examples of company driving manuals out on the web, here's just one example from a major employer: http://www.drivingforbetterbusiness.com ... manual.pdf
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Re: Driving for work private and hire cars

Post by Andyblue »

Hi Mel, Joe many drivers are we talking about? You could check licences yourself or outsource it - there are lots of providers with varying ways for reporting back to you. Did use a risk based system starting at 6 or -2 months then reducing the period depending on the points accrued. Require them to report any offences incurred during business miles and any points / disq, however they are incurred if driving company veh ( including those hired by Co).
Lots of small things you can do that ensure biz drivers are appropriately legal.
Happy to discuss fourth st if you want to PM
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Re: Driving for work private and hire cars

Post by stephen1974 »

Mel GT wrote: Thu Jun 27, 2019 3:36 pm I am tempted to say this is not enough if we are not having sight of the relevant docs or proof that the person is legal to drive - nor does this show any patterns with dangerous driving through fines etc.

Similarly we don't licence check any drivers hiring cars we 'trust' that they are legal to drive

I am proposing we use a service such as IAM or Davis
I've just started having to drive for work and was required to provide a copy of my insurance to show I had business insurance, a copy of my MOT (which i lost but youc an check online anyway) and there is a free checking service for driver records where the driver requests a code from a government website https://www.gov.uk/view-driving-licence gives it to the employer and they can check if you have points on your licence. It also shows what vehicles you are licensed to drive.
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Re: Driving for work private and hire cars

Post by Woodie »

There is also a driving for work toolkit available on the attached link

https://www.scorsa.org.uk/
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http://nott-us.co.uk/
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Re: Driving for work private and hire cars

Post by grim72 »

Also don't forget they should be doing their ore-drive vehicle checks to ensure the vehicle is in good / safe condition. Our app is proving a popular tool for this - happy to send you details if interested - just let me know.
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Re: Driving for work private and hire cars

Post by Blackstone »

Hi Mel,

You should definitely be checking driving licences. Stephen has already posted the link and process above. We do this with all our drivers.
There was a issue at my last company where a lorry driver got banned for drink driving, didn't tell the company and continued to drive the 7.5t lorry for a few month until the rumour mill revealed his misdemeanour! He subsequently got fired!
Around about the same time a policeman claimed for personal injury against one of our service engineers (2 years and 10 months previous the police car hit our service van). Turns out the service engineer had since moved, not updated his licence address and it had expired thus causing a big drama.

Moral of the story is, you must keep on top of the licence checks and do it every 6 months. It doesn't take long for points to tot up and someone want to keep it a secret.

With regards to driving personal cars, you can check a car is taxed and MOT'd easily online so just need the employee to provided evidence they are insured for business use. You could just keep a simple spreadsheet.

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Re: Driving for work private and hire cars

Post by Mel GT »

Thanks Bernie
this is what I thought, needed to hear it form peers I guess.....my employer is just doing the declaration only at present so trying to firm up my paper as much as I can :)
bernicarey wrote: Thu Jun 27, 2019 4:06 pm All people driving on company business, whether company vehicles or their own, should be license checked because if you allow them to operate vehicles when disqualified etc then you are failing to take reasonable measures to protect employees and 'others'. Usually once a year will suffice.

Here's a good starting point: http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/indg382.pdf

There's plenty of examples of company driving manuals out on the web, here's just one example from a major employer: http://www.drivingforbetterbusiness.com ... manual.pdf
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Re: Driving for work private and hire cars

Post by RPN_MSC »

Good morning everyone.

Sorry to bring up an old thread but it is still relevant and has been very interesting.

I am in the process of developing a procedure and risk assessment for driving within our organisation. We do not provide company cars so people must either use their own vehicles or hired cars. With reference to hire cars, I am correct in stating the following aren't I?

"There is an expectation that any hired vehicle is provided in a safe, roadworthy and legal condition. However, that does not relieve you of your requirement to check the vehicle upon collection and throughout the hire period to ensure that the vehicle always remains in a roadworthy condition. In the eyes of the law, once you drive the vehicle you are accepting responsibility for the roadworthiness of the vehicle."

Does anyone have any further pointers of where to look for guidance in developing these documents? So far I have taken pre-departure vehicle checks from the AA and the Skanska document linked already in this thread has been really useful. I did have a look on HSE's website but it seemed to be more focused on managing driving on site (not something we do) and those who are expressly employed to drive. Our employees use vehicles to get to different events that they are involved in.
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Re: Driving for work private and hire cars

Post by Andyblue »

Be pro-active with the policy, procedures and of course the management of them. Consider where the hire cars are coming from and what criteria you want to impose as max & min spec. The company environmental policy may expect EV /Hybrid as preferred options over ICE, option for auto/manual gearbox, no 4x4 hired, min/max engine size/power or emissions etc. For private use vehicles, would you put a vehicle age limit on them, and if their vehicle is older, then a hire car must be used instead - the employee doesn't lose out then. Of course, in opting for private car, if it breakdown then it's their issue to still get to the appointment. Do you have a driving at work policy to work from?
If you already have fleet insurance, have you approached the insurers/ brokers for some guidance as yet?
The challenges are there whether it's a single private user of a 1000 car fleet.
Just a few thoughts for you😃
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Re: Driving for work private and hire cars

Post by RPN_MSC »

Morning.

Thank you for your reply. I will answer your questions in turn:

1. We are developing a central hire car booking system. At the moment we tend to use Enterprise and I am not sure it is written down anywhere as to what vehicle class you can get etc. It varies really on the task, sometimes people need to carry a lot of items so they will need a bigger car.
2. I don't know that Enterprise (for example) are yet offering details on emissions of particular vehicles? Cost also has to come into things.
3. Why would we need to put an age limit on private vehicles? If a car is in a roadworthy condition then it remains so regardless of age. Ecologically, encouraging employees to throw away perfectly functioning vehicles seems counterproductive.
4. There is no driving for work policy, that is what we are developing.
5. We don't have fleet insurance.

There are definitely a lot of things to think about. I think at this moment in time we are looking to just get something in place which can be developed and refined over time. Better to have something rather than nothing?
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Re: Driving for work private and hire cars

Post by Andyblue »

Some quick replies and answered in reverse orde which may make sense
5. No fleet Ins- makes things easy so all driving currently in private or hire cars that have Ins included - can be costly to have business use cover depending on your business
4. No policy - appreciate the want to put things in place. Doing so without having risk assessed, basic policy etc is an interesting and challenging business decision. We might want to prioritise and get them done so you know what to do next
3. Veh age: big range of emissions, pre 2004 ABS not mandatory, probably depends on Co policy on other things as well.
2. Emissions: affects private as well as hire: with so many LEZ in place and coming, be ready to pay the charges if not compliant. Lots of options with hire Co
1. Vehicles: is fully a car with loose goods/ materials a good idea? Is A loose laptop flying off the back shelf in a collision really good business safety? Would a van with a bulkhead be the more appropriate vehicle?

Out of interest what type of business are we looking at?
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