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Did you vote?

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safetygal
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Did you vote?

Post by safetygal »

IOSH Council is a great way to get your voice heard, Council’s role is to champion and represent your views to the Board of Trustees.

This year some great candidates were chosen and they will do you proud, but did you know that less than 4000 members out of a possible 48000 actually voted? :cry:

There were two hustings held where the candidates answered your questions, would you believe only 25 listeners turned up! .scratch

I am not asking who you voted for - thats personal, but I do have a few questions
  • did you vote?
      and if you did, what was your motivation?
        If you didnt vote, why?
          what could IOSH do differently?
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        witsd
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        Re: Did you vote?

        Post by witsd »

        I didn't even consider voting, probably for two reasons.

        Primarily, I've never really felt that IOSH do much for me, and I honestly don't believe that altering the faces within the council will alter that. Maybe I'm just too jaded for any form of politics?!

        Second, I did skim through the candidates' profiles knowing that I wouldn't vote for the above reason, and I think that as I did, you could probably hear me rolling my eyes at all the trite, trope-like catchwords and phrases that 90% of the candidates wrote. It's a microcosm of everything I hate about the world of employment AND politics, where all promises are meaningless - they are either broken immediately or were just impossible to start with (or better yet, they were never actually made due to loopholes in the wording), and covered up by a thin layer of pretty fluff.

        This is why I can't spend more than 30 seconds on LinkedIn before I start thinking that maybe some workplace accidents wouldn't be so bad...
        We often think that when we have completed our study of one we know all about two, because 'two' is 'one and one.' We forget that we still have to make a study of 'and.'
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        safetygal
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        Re: Did you vote?

        Post by safetygal »

        witsd wrote: Thu Oct 21, 2021 2:13 pm

        Primarily, I've never really felt that IOSH do much for me, and I honestly don't believe that altering the faces within the council will alter that. Maybe I'm just too jaded for any form of politics?!

        Thanks Witsd for your honesty, if it was an ideal world, what could IOSH do for you?
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        Re: Did you vote?

        Post by witsd »

        It's a difficult question to answer - where do you start?!

        I've previously been a member of IOSH and one other organisation and after a couple of years, I decided to let both memberships lapse. My current employer doesn't require it, and I've honestly found a combination of this forum and general internet tinkering far more useful as a source of information, discussion and debate than any paid resource.

        Now, did I take full advantage of all the facilities IOSH offers? Almost certainly not. Why not? I guess ease of access is a factor, but somehow the sheer size of the organisation makes it less useful for the day-to-day stuff.

        As for the other aspects of the organisation, well that is politics, and if the last few years have taught us anything, it's that the government will do whatever makes them look good while costing the least, irrespective of whatever professional bodies advise and / or lobby for.

        I'm sure it's more complicated than that and plenty goes on behind the scenes - without IOSH, it would probably be a lot worse, but none of that is particularly visible unless you go specifically looking for it.

        Like I said, I suspect I'm just a little jaded with the whole process!
        We often think that when we have completed our study of one we know all about two, because 'two' is 'one and one.' We forget that we still have to make a study of 'and.'
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        safetygal
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        Re: Did you vote?

        Post by safetygal »

        You make some good points, it can be easy to feel lost in a large crowd. Perhaps IOSH need to look at how individuals can feel included (not just you but everyone)

        I know for myself, I didnt go to the local IOSH meetings because I don't drive due to a hidden disability, for me it was near on impossible without having to rely on others. so HSFB forum was a brilliant alternative (as we all know).

        During COVID IOSH were forced to take their meetings online, I was able to get more involved and I made it clear to them that it should continue, not just for me but for the thousands of others like me. This is one of the reasons why I wanted to get on the IOSH Council because I wanted to make these kind of changes and make a difference, it was in my pledge to support people with disabilities because I am impacted by that. I would not have broken my promise. I did not get in sadly, I just missed my place by a few votes.

        as for our government - don't get me started! [smilie=boese055.gif] #thosewhoknowmeknow
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        Re: Did you vote?

        Post by EagleBeagle »

        To answer your question I did vote, for you, as a matter of fact. I only voted as I remembered your post on the forum.

        Like witsd, I find IOSH to be an organisation that I struggle to define a purpose for beyond it's artful collection of membership fees and training income. I don't believe any of the branches, the Council, or the new gimmick "Future Leaders" has any impact on IOSH's direction or its contribution. Despite this, in my experience the majority of things which are useful in day-to-day terms are done by individual branches, e.g. CPD events, events about professional development, sharing of best practice, etc. However, I found getting active in a branch to be the least accessible part of IOSH.

        To answer your last question, I feel that IOSH needs to focus on its members. I've dozens of very experienced colleagues who've let their membership lapse over the years as they felt they were receiving no benefit, that they were simply numbers on a spreadsheet or a mailing list to be sold IOSH Managing Safely [Insert Gimmick Here] training. If IOSH wants to attract and retain members, it needs to focus on offering them something beyond a brand.

        Similarly, CMIOSH has it's own issues despite being held as the ultimate contribution of IOSH to the profession. In the end, given the difficulty of the process and the fact that it's rarely required for roles, I put my two years efforts and investment into a Masters which I predict will have a greater early career impact than spending two years on a gathering a labyrinthine portfolio of five emails about X, five emails and 2 copies of risk assessment Y, etc.
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        Re: Did you vote?

        Post by safetygal »

        Thank you for your vote - thats really kind of you.

        and, thank you for answering my questions, I agree that the IOSH meetings do not feel accessible and do need to change, i find that this has improved over lock down but there is still alot to go. CMIOSH does, in my opinion hold alot of sway in companies - but i think an issue may be that some businesses may not understand why, they just know that it is a good thing to have and that becomes apparent on so many job descriptions. so many times have I seen must have IOSH certificate and CMIOSH or NEBOSH certificate and CMIOSH - I think this is where education and culture is key in business, but I guess that is also why they are advertising for a HSE Manager!

        I personally enjoyed the process of the portfolio, It gave the opportunity to see the great work I had done over time and feel proud of myself, I did it for me and not for business - but we all do it for different reasons. I too have the Masters, congratulations - its a hard course but so worthwhile - I go to my Hull Graduation in January and I am excited :)
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        Re: Did you vote?

        Post by EagleBeagle »

        safetygal wrote: Wed Oct 27, 2021 10:33 am Thank you for your vote - thats really kind of you.

        and, thank you for answering my questions, I agree that the IOSH meetings do not feel accessible and do need to change, i find that this has improved over lock down but there is still alot to go. CMIOSH does, in my opinion hold alot of sway in companies - but i think an issue may be that some businesses may not understand why, they just know that it is a good thing to have and that becomes apparent on so many job descriptions. so many times have I seen must have IOSH certificate and CMIOSH or NEBOSH certificate and CMIOSH - I think this is where education and culture is key in business, but I guess that is also why they are advertising for a HSE Manager!

        I personally enjoyed the process of the portfolio, It gave the opportunity to see the great work I had done over time and feel proud of myself, I did it for me and not for business - but we all do it for different reasons. I too have the Masters, congratulations - its a hard course but so worthwhile - I go to my Hull Graduation in January and I am excited :)
        You're very welcome and I hope that I didn't come across as being overly critical - 'twas a hard day on site when that post was written!

        Well to actually get in contact with a physical branch that I was assigned to upon registering as a member it took three weeks of emailing people in IOSH - the membership department ignored the email, there was no email listed for the branch on its IOSH website page, and it was only via a coordinator of one of the IOSH groups that knew the details of the branch that I was ever able to reach the chairperson. However, I agree that it has improved in the last 12 months with the online meetings and events.

        Usually I see "must be IOSH member" or "IOSH membership desirable" and most employers are satisfied with Graduate Membership in my experience. Please don't think I'm belittling the CMIOSH status, it is valuable both as a professional achievement and businesses definitely need to understand the value of it. It also depends highly on the business and sector, there's a huge range between Tier 1 companies who know what they want and other small to mid-size organisations that want anyone as long as their title/qualification says HSE Officer or Manager (also many making poor distinctions even between those titles but that's another discussion).

        As I say there is likely to be personal value in the process but when there are many competing priorities, as someone at an early to mid-point in the HSE world, it can appear like just another chore added onto the pile and not something you want to be chasing colleagues down for emails to use for a portfolio (particularly in reactive workplaces). However, as I say that's just my perception at the time without truly becoming immersed into the process.
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        SteveDDon
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        Re: Did you vote?

        Post by SteveDDon »

        Hi,

        I didn't vote as I've let my membership lapse due to having retired.

        I did consider moving to a retired membership but couldn't realistically justify the cost when living on a small NHS pension.

        When I joined IOSH it was as a technician Safety Practitioner (I had a TUC Level 3 Certification) and CPD was not a requirement and as a Union H&S Rep this has okay as all CPD had to be paid for by myself and done at home. The membership then became a Technician level and then Technical, all of which required CPD to be done and to be honest as I was not in a full time H&S role this meant I had to find time to attempt to get to IOSH Branch meetings with had moved to during the working day, and to get CPD done was difficult as my managers did not want to give me any more time than the absolute minimum I needed to do my union role which had expanded quite a bit.
        I did once attend the healthcare meeting in Scotland (I had to take annual leave to do so) but felt I was not really welcome as they were discussing items they did not want people from outwith the Paid professionals to be aware of, or involved in.

        If you could take anything to the IOSH council for me it would be a level of membership for people who like me were/are not in a full time H&S role.

        Getting the H&S professionals to engage with the Union H&S Reps would also be useful as when they do they get a second H&S team for free. Highland Council has a Safety Rep Charter which works well.

        Sorry I've rambled on a bit, but I felt that these are issues which need addressing.

        Steve
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        Re: Did you vote?

        Post by ddlh »

        Hi safetygal

        Hello - I didn't vote either as my personal view is that IOSH hierarchy - as others have inferred - are more focused on Training fees and membership dues.

        I only joined IOSH as I was advised that it would be needed to progress in my career and it turned out to be true - especially with the automatic checking of CVs looking for key words and rejecting those that didnt have them. So I was accepted for employment in my industry due to the IOSH "badge" as well as my other skills which Alexis here did wonders in getting them to look right on my CV (Eternal thanks Alexis xx).

        However - the badge will not hide graduates who come straight from university to a construction site - and challenging a site foreman because that's not what is says in the University hand out! So some employers - in my view - are blinkered in their choice looking for IOSH graduates only.
        I know some guys in construction who can build anything you like - safely, on time, within budget but who have no paper qualifications due to dyslexia - but bits of paper count with IOSH.

        I did attend some local branch meetings over the years only to find the same committee guys year after year preaching the same messages about the industry making good progress but this didnt match up to my experiences on the work face.
        My industry uses a lot of contractors contractors - who on their welcome meetings to promote good safety ethics and expected high safety behaviours - are being given 45 days notice of redundancy - as a legal requirement! Moral boosting??

        Like yourself - I started logging into the online meetings during lock down and really think they should continue - but I "need to mingle and network" I was advised - sorry but I have a network of people I know and can trust - not someone at a meeting who could possibly help me to move employer if someone has a vacancy.

        IOSH recognising the safety reps and union officials officially would really help a lot. My industry is trampling people into the ground with cut backs for travel time, training, as well as day rates.

        Take a pipe fitter for example - they are forced into training for an employers - say -PTW system - often without pay - and made redundant after the job is finished. They then move to another employer - and have to train on that employers systems - very similar but different.
        So in 20 years - maybe 40 employers - maybe 60 different systems?
        So much for one workable system across the Oil and Gas industry - one risk assessment and permit system. Now that would be something IOSH could be fighting for - but they dont see it - and their branch leaders are not feeding this back to them.

        Sorry this has ended up a rant but there is so much that IOSH could be doing for their root members - but dare I say - the guys that get their hands dirty don't have a say!

        Kind Regards
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