Working hours

[Frances]

Hi all

I have been working for a company for just over 6 months now and have not received a contract. I travel a bit with the company and on the weeks that i do travel i leave early and home late (usually for 2 days). We work a 40 hour week, only I seem to work 50+ . There is an option to work to 6 in the evening four days a week and home early on a friday (1 o'clock finish), but with me away for two of those days its impossible to work up 4 hours in two days that I am in the office. So they have agreed that they would give me an hour for each day that i'm away.
So my query is, since I'm apparently getting paid for my travel too (salary not good) then I should be able to count that as working hours and get away earlier on a friday?? I knew there was travelling involved but is there not some rule about working over 40 hours a week?

Can anyone advise if they are doing anything wrong? I dont want to ask them and rock the boat as I do need my job but i'm tired all the time.

[PaulDonaldson]

Frances

Im sure our resident employment law expert will give you good advice on this, but my take on it is that as you are being paid for travel that should count as part of your 40 hours and if you are doing 10 hours a day for the first 4 days do you need to go in on Friday. I fully appreciate that people do want to work more than their alloted hours to help out but you have to make sure it does not affect your health, remember driving whilst tired is more dangerous than normal driving.

Paul

[Reddwarf]

From my previous job we would regularly work more than 40+ hours it could be as much as 80hrs this was mainly due to working a 12 hr shift pattern and having to cover holidays etc. But as part of my contract we had so sign to say we where willing to work over the 40 hrs.

The driving you refer to is it other than driving from your home to work what would be a normal commute.

Maybe look at keeping a record of what time you start driving for work and what time you get back to the place you are staying. just make sure that you are not trying to include what would be normal commuting mileage (from home to place of normal work). then with this information you can show the hours you are working.

Red

[Frances]

thanks Paul for the reply

[Lisa_]

Hiya,

In my role the first hour each way is counted as your normal commute, anything over that counts as your working day.

That said we have taken on a guy in a regional role and he doesn't live anywhere near were the area he applied for is.He doesn't have the first hour rule as this would be unworkable. He choose this role, having been provided with the info that the nearest job would be 2.5 hours away. Slightly different circumstances with him as it would be highly likely that he could spend 8 hours a day travelling which could mean only doing an hours work in the middle !!!!!!!!!!!

Interesting topic!

[Frances]

Lisa

It takes me 25/30 minutes to get to work in the morning. For example i had to travel to a site first thing on monday morning, which is not my normal place/s of work and i had to leave over an hour earlier. Surely i can count this towards time off. When i go to the airport i am away at 5 in the morning and i work to 6.30 in the evening, stay at a hotel, up and in the office for 8 in the morning (start time usually 8.30am) and by the time i fly back and get home from the airport the next evening is approx 10.30 pm and this usually takes place every week or every other week depending on the workload. Theup and back in work the next morning at 8.30am.
I am getting exhausted and my pay certainly does not reflect the hours I do.

[Peter Cary]

Hi Lisa,

In my role the first hour each way is counted as your normal commute, anything over that counts as your working day.

That said we have taken on a guy in a regional role and he doesn't live anywhere near were the area he applied for is.He doesn't have the first hour rule as this would be unworkable. He choose this role, having been provided with the info that the nearest job would be 2.5 hours away. Slightly different circumstances with him as it would be highly likely that he could spend 8 hours a day travelling which could mean only doing an hours work in the middle !!!!!!!!!!!

Interesting topic!

Your company's driving at work policy seems VERY suspect to me especially in the light of the Corporate Manslaughter and Homicide Bill of 2008, which requires many things of an employer, but basically are encompassed in this HSE booklet

Click here for "Driving at work"

Click here for the Bill

PM as to what steps I feel you should take to cover your company's back as a matter of urgency

Hi Frances,

It would appear your company is also on pretty dodgy ground with you, no contract, I presume no company driving policy either!

PM if you want to talk things through.

[Reddwarf]

you refer to others in the office who work a 40 hour week, are they doing the same job as you if they have a different role then it is no good comparing your working hours to theirs. You accepted the job was going to involve travelling and long hours is what you need to do is to look at what is acceptable working hours for your role if you are getting in as late as 10.30pm then it might be agreeing with you boss that you will come in later the next day to allow you time to recover and proper rest. Are there other employees doing the same job as you and working the same hours talk to them and get their views. Then talk to your boss showing him the hours you are working. H e might not be aware of the hours you work or has turned a blind eye to it as you have not spoken to him about it.

Although you don't have a contract how are you paid are you paid a set salary and no indication of hours required to work or are paid a set salary stating a 40 hrs week and time above this additional pay will be made (overtime).

Because of the shift pattern i worked some weeks might be 50 hrs but the next week might be 36hrs but virtually all of use did overtime which could add upto an additional 100hrs overtime a month

Red

[Frances]

I did know that travelling was involved which i dont mind. But when the changed all the office hours to get home early on a friday i didnt like it cos regardless whether i travel or dont travel 40 hours have to be worked so i cannot take time off when i am less busy. i am the only one who does this job but in other cases where an employee needs to stay later to approx 10 or 11 at night to finish a tender they get a day of against it.
The only other who travel are the directors and lets face it they are getting well paid and have a personal interest in the company and can come and go as they please. One other employee travels but he gets paid at least twice my salary and takes time off but i feel he more thought of than me or my position in the company.
I have previously spoke to the employer about this but he just thought i had a problem with the travelling. Which is not the case, I like my job but it's very tiring and i would like some slack cut without having to offend anyone or make them think i'm not up to the job. I fell i should automatically get a half day off on a friday without having to stay to 6 the other two days that i am in the office.
The driving I do is to the airport and back and wahtever driving is involved on the other side, which can be 2-3 hours to a site and back again. I dont have a problem with my normal commute as i'm not that far, but if i have to go to a sister company which was not originally in my job description i fell i should get the time off as well as my mileage (i get mileage).

[Peter Cary]

Hi Frances,

Commuting to your normal work place is not considered as part of your working day. However driving to different venue i.e. "your sister" company is.

Bottom of page 3 "Driving for Work" booklet link already posted in this thread.

It appears the company maybe not complying with their duty of care to their employees.

[gadders]

Hi, Not sure this is any help, but dont you need to sign an agreement if the working week is over 48hours not 40?

Dave

[danwel]

the whole 48+ hours mentioned in the above post comes down to being able to opt out of the working time directive.

I am in a similar postion to you, i took the job to be north east regional trainer but in all honesty 50% of the time i spend outside of the north east and because of where i live i end up travelling hours to get to work but at times that is my own fault as i would rather set off slightly earlier than stay overnight.

I can sympathise with the whole salary situation and in the same position myself too but i very much doubt that is likely to change so i am guessing the decision is down to either putting up with it or possibly moving on to another job/company and if it is the latter again i can sympathise as i too am moving on early next year even if i have to take a backwards step as there just comes a time when it is all too much hassle.

Good luck in your decision and keep your chin up, at least we have jobs in the current economic climate